Daniel Amos Message Board | Print: DA 30th Anniversary Edition

Posted by Mountain Fan on 06-08-2009 at11:50:

quote:

Originally posted by Mountain Fan
OK, I say it is ultra-rare and less than 1,000 copies were produced unless someone tells me otherwise. Tongue

actually the more i think about this i doubt more than a few hundred pre-order 3rd discs were produced since the time from announcement to shipment seems like it was a few short months rather than years.

i thought i got mine signed once, but i checked and it is not autographed.

Posted by Audiori J on 06-08-2009 at14:07:

Your estimations are obviously not based on any knowledge of how many CDs they sell of any given release.

Posted by Mountain Fan on 06-09-2009 at09:25:

so i suppose you're not going to enlighten us on how many thousands or tens of thousands of pre-order discs were produced? Tongue

Posted by audiori on 06-09-2009 at09:36:

First, we've always had the policy of not giving out sales numbers. Thats why when certain artists out there in the past put on their website that certain DA titles sold a certain amount, or took a certain amount of time to sell out - we can all know that they're full of it. If the bands want to release sales data, they're free to do so.. but, I don't think its our place to do it for them.

Secondly, we have stated before that our customer base is around 10,000 and growing weekly. Obviously, thats not the total fan base.. just the online customer base. You'll have to explain to me why that has become a joke to a couple of you.

Posted by Audiori J on 06-09-2009 at10:33:

Yeah in their heyday they were selling somewhere around 60,000 copies, by 1996 Terry said it was somewhere around 20 to 30 thousand. (Darn Floor was a disapointment at 8,000 copies sold.)

Those fans still exist, some have lost track of the bands over the years. But, Terry has gained many new fans as well through the Lost Dogs, the Neverhood and Catscratch stuff. There may be more 'Neverhood Music' fans than there are DA fans.

When we took over the websites we were given a customer list of zero, not that there were no fans, but nobody kept track of the mailing list apparently. Since that time we have built the customer list up to where it is now, but we constantly hear from people who had lost track and refound the band. And we also get emails from people that just found the Lost Dogs, or came to the site looking for Imaginarium and bought a couple other albums and loved them.

Posted by Ritchie_az on 06-09-2009 at10:48:

I have a friend that, when I first met him eight years ago, thought that DA disbanded after Shotgun Angel. He saw them in concert several times during their "cowboy" days. He was shocked to learn that DA had just released a new album.

Posted by Audiori J on 06-09-2009 at10:57:

I sat next to a guy at Cornerstone a couple years ago, that was in the exact same boat. He was an older guy, loved the Shotgun Angel stuff, and didn't have the internet. When Terry and the guys sang "Aint Gonna Fight It," he said to me, 'Oh I have missed that voice.' I think, that was the only song he seemed to know through the whole show.

Posted by Mountain Fan on 06-09-2009 at11:44:

quote:

Originally posted by bigdork.2
Cool

$52.78

I believe this (presumably for 3-disc set) was when the 2-disc was still available in the webstore?! Shocked

Posted by Mountain Fan on 06-09-2009 at12:00:

quote:

Originally posted by audiori
First, we've always had the policy of not giving out sales numbers. Thats why when certain artists out there in the past put on their website that certain DA titles sold a certain amount, or took a certain amount of time to sell out - we can all know that they're full of it. If the bands want to release sales data, they're free to do so.. but, I don't think its our place to do it for them.

Secondly, we have stated before that our customer base is around 10,000 and growing weekly. Obviously, thats not the total fan base.. just the online customer base. You'll have to explain to me why that has become a joke to a couple of you.

well i can respect not giving out numbers, and that makes good business sense. Smile

i think it's a good guess less than 500 pre-order discs were produced and the run of 2-CD versions was probably not more than 5,000. Certainly not more than 10,000. no need to confirm or comment. if i decide to list it i will say the 3-disc version is ultra-rare in relation to all the copies of this produced over the years in all formats.

i would say if someone checked the webstore once a month they would not be "full of it" in coming up with how long it took something to sell out? it seems that is publicly observable? i didn't look that close myself but it took what, maybe 2 years for this one to sell out? i looked a few times infrequently because i was thinking of getting a copy or two as gifts for friends that like the old-time jesus music stuff.

i don't remember for sure but i think the tens of thousands joke related to activity on the board? from what is publicly observable it seems like there is not that much posting going on, but you guys always say there are all these guests and such? i never thought it was worth it to argue the point and get into the technical details of how boards track users logging on and off and such like some did, but i believe this was the source? of course it could have related to sales of discs too at some point in time, but i believe it was more mb-activity related. if anyone cares enough i'm sure they could look up some old posts and set the record straight, but i don't care to.

Posted by audiori on 06-09-2009 at12:06:

The only time the 10,000 number has been used was in relation to our customer database. It may have at some point been used a base number for an estimate of the size of the total fan base, since.. obviously, the total fan base has to be larger.

Its nearly impossible to estimate how many people visit the message board. Overall activity (which we can see, you can't) has stayed pretty steady since the second year. Posting activity has risen and fallen repeatedly... there tends to be spikes and drop offs each year. Looking back at the data and graphs, its like a rollercoaster of ups and downs. The only times that were noticeably different were the first year when we barely had anyone here, the release of "midget" which gave us a spike and the two DA chats which brought in a bunch of extra guests.

We also would not suggest that we've ever had 10,000 people on the message board because the record is currently only 400 at one time. The actual number of visitors is most likely higher than that, because I doubt everyone showed up at the same time on that day. One thing is for sure however.. its not *us* saying that there are "all these visitors." Its the actual data kept by the board (not what you guys can see, but on our admin control panel). Some have suggested that maybe we can't tell the difference between regular people and search bots.. we can. They show up differently. They behave differently. So do duplicate users.

I don't know why this is such a controversy. Theres only a couple of people disputing it and none of them can see the data... so what are they basing it on? Feelings? Why this is even important to anyone other than us is a mystery to me.

The comment about how long something took to sell out was in reference to a website from another artist that made a claim that a certain Limited Edition DA title took a couple of years to sell out. It was actually a title that sold out in probably a matter of weeks. Thats what I mean.. they have no actual data but will still make weird claims like that.. usually trying to make the band look bad.

Posted by Audiori J on 06-09-2009 at12:37:

quote:

Originally posted by Mountain Fan
i would say if someone checked the webstore once a month they would not be "full of it" in coming up with how long it took something to sell out? it seems that is publicly observable? i didn't look that close myself but it took what, maybe 2 years for this one to sell out? i looked a few times infrequently because i was thinking of getting a copy or two as gifts for friends that like the old-time jesus music stuff.

Its also a strange thing to estimate based on how long something took to sell out, not knowing how many were printed in the first place. Some titles have been printed in the thousands of copies and sold out rather quickly, other titles were printed in much smaller numbers and have not sold out yet. Some titles we just keep reprinting over and over to keep them in stock. So the amount of time it takes for something to 'sell out' is not a good representation of how many were printed.

I mean for example, DA 30th, do you know how many were originally printed? Or if the title was reprinted more than once before we ran out? You can't know that information, because we have never given it out. So any number you pick would be simply pulled out of the air.

Sometimes when something takes forever to 'sell out', that means it was selling well and we reprinted it over and over until it slowed down and we let it run out. The fact it may have taken a couple years, doesn't mean that it took that long to sell one single printing.

And yes, we stated that the customer base of the store was in the 10,000 range and that was made fun of because I assume people that don't have access to the actual information know better than those of us that do.

The sales numbers for albums, would include the website sales, wholesale to other websites and stores which we have done, and the guys tours. Often when something new is printed and there is a tour to go with it, multiple printings of the new album are done to support the websites, the tour and other outlets. Not to mention Cornerstone and other festivals which can lead to a huge number of sales.

Posted by MarkyMark77 on 06-09-2009 at14:58:

quote:

There may be more 'Neverhood Music' fans than there are DA fans.

There is a certain segment in geekdom who love that music. Which leads me to a question (off the topic): has there been more invitations to do that sort of thing? Since Terry did such a good job, and it was very well-received, I'm surprised that he didn't get more of those kind of jobs coming his way. Or, maybe he didn't want to do a lot of it?

Posted by audiori on 06-09-2009 at15:05:

He's had a lot of interest in the cartoon world with folks like Warner Bros. wanting him to do soundtracks. To date, I don't know that any of them have really taken off (aside from the TenNapel creations of course). Of course, it takes a long time to actually get a cartoon on the air so one of these shows could still make it.

Posted by UnderDawg on 06-09-2009 at18:18:

I've got a question for you....when a CD is reprinted, is it indicated anywhere on the booklet or packaging? Can you know if you have a first printing like with a book?

Posted by audiori on 06-09-2009 at19:01:

Only when its changed in some way (different artwork, liner notes, bonus tracks, etc). If its the same as before, then no one will know when a new printing is being sold.

Posted by Audiori J on 06-09-2009 at19:47:

Tennapel is doing a Ghostopolis movie with Disney and Hugh Jackman is playing the lead role. It would be cool if Terry could get in on that one.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/news/e3i06056b3e43453484cf93314e8fae8d78

Posted by Mountain Fan on 06-10-2009 at12:26:

the DA 30th 3rd disc was termed a gift for preorderers. there is no contract or agreement not to resell it, correct? i saw nothing on it to even imply such.

if you don't like someone maybe selling something rare for a lot of $ you shouldn't put it out in the first place for whatever reason ... gift, exclusive, limited edition etc.

it's kinda like making a loan to a family member ... if you do it, you go into it knowing you might never get your money back and should decide right then and there if it will ruin the relationship or not ... or if you even want to make the loan in the first place ...

you give a gift for the joy of it and hope it pleases the recipient. if you later find out the recipient re-gifted it, sold, or exchanged it and have issues with that ... well, then you have issues...